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 Post subject: Re: Outside looking in
PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2012 3:28 pm 
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The biggest red flag I saw in your post was that you try to take all her life stressors away. The issue with that is -- it's not real.

It's essential that she learn to deal with stress instead of having someone else eliminate it. In the early stages, she will need extra support, and I won't lie -- until she realizes she has some problems to work through, and starts to get help, she will more than likely blame you for the relationships short comings.

When I got back with my partner, I lost a lot of "friends". I realize now its best to keep some things private, especially in a bpd relationship.

However, to the ones who did stick by me, I explained it like this. In my bpd world, there are two realities: the one inside my head (the bpd), and the one that is really happening.

When I'm in scary bpd land, things are tainted. People are unfair, harsh and cruel one minute, and the next they are an idol; placed on a pedestal with me down below looking up.

When I step out from that shadow and look at what is really going on, I'm able to discern where my faults lie and where his faults begin. It's tricky sometimes because I think I'm being rational but really I'm so colored in my perceptions.

Outside, I wonder if showing her this forum is the right thing. When I was first diagnosed, I wanted to know everything I could. I would have truly appreciated if my partner wanted to soak up that knowledge too - but his argument was that he had loved me this far, and a label didn't change that. He believes that knowledge can be dangerous- that it can make it worse.

If she hasn't stepped outside bpd land and realized she needs help, your words might fall on deaf ears - but if she is anything like me, she will probably go through a depressed state. That's the time to gently ask her if maybe she'd like to talk about it with a gp. That's what happened with me. They put me on some meds and it didn't help so I was referred to a psychiatrist. But I was willing, because I was depressed and suicidal. My life wAs at stake- and if I'm honest, I hadn't really ever lived. I wanted to fight for that happiness- that richness.

She might be scared. I was, but I was quietly hopeful that this meant a second chance. It's not uncommon for us bpd'rs to have experienced significant trauma in our lives and that's where some of our emotional dysfunction can come from --- old patterns which saved us from pain as children but do not serve us in adulthood. Be prepared if those skeletons come out - they are painful to confront.

I can't tell you exactly how she will be. While there are certain criteria which define our disorder; the criteria does NOT define who we are as people. We each have our own personalities, journeys, coping mechanisms and functioning levels. My biggest trigger is relationships. Those high times, I'm flying. The low times; I'm dying.

When she is ready, and you will know when that is, broach it delicately. Maybe say that you've noticed there are some things in your relationship which need some fine tuning. Tell her that you understand how she must feel but in order for your love to blossom and flourish, you each need to address the concerns. Tell her what your concerns are. Don't diagnose - that's for her and a doctor to do.

Be aware, that if she is diagnosed and she comes here for support, she may recognize herself in your posts and feel betrayed. Best to be upfront about that when the time is right.

Remember, you are welcome here. It's admirable that you want to help her, and support her. I highly recommend reading the tools on this site. They are useful not just for people with bpd but also for people who struggle with emotions and communication/ anger/ anxiety.

I love it here. It's my haven, and we all are supportive of each other. Be positive - it's like that old adage, " love conquers all"... Even bpd, but SELF love is the most important of all and that's why your boundaries are crucial for both of you.


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 Post subject: Re: Outside looking in
PostPosted: Sun Sep 01, 2013 11:21 pm 
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…this is a test… “Outside here,” I’ve attempted to respond to this thread for months but it has never posted… couldn’t even find a forum moderator to help… so I’ll try again~


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 Post subject: Re: Outside looking in
PostPosted: Mon Sep 02, 2013 12:35 am 
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OK – I’m back in… after a year! Where am I and what have I learned? …well first, Jaded Angel, I had pages of response for you, but as mentioned, they were lost from the inability to post… I have gone elsewhere, as suggested, and feel I’ve learned a lot. Sorry I couldn’t answer… but will move on for the moment.

My relationship has likely experienced 6 ‘recycles.’ I initiated the last break, leaving five as hers. I’ve always felt it was her prerogative to determine whether she wants me in her life or not, with the same for me. So I respected her decisions and attempted to move on… I believe our longest time apart was three months, with most gaps lasting just over one. Though she’s worked fast to replace me, I’m honestly convinced she’s not slept with anyone else, nor have I. We’re definitely attracted to each other’s sexual energy, but a deep caring for each other’s family has grown as well. We still live apart, she’s now into a home I helped her acquire (for which she still owes me money) and have been seeing each other between her extremely active and constantly ‘booked up’ life.

…too lazy to re-read all the prior posts… I had gently described my conclusion of her suffering from BPD nearly a year ago. She denied it, and accused me of trying to hurt her. I had read a suggestion here that I approach various symptoms or situations in an ‘individual way.’ That doesn’t work. She recognizes and anticipates the problem and is more than ready to ‘defend’ her behavior. And though an apology eventually follows, this gets us nowhere. Since BPD is a set of known behaviors, ignoring the larger picture by focusing on the details doesn’t appear to work.

She has sought therapy, but appears only to be nibbling around the edges of the greater issue. I’m not familiar with the therapist but doubt she’s well versed in treating BPD. Some therapy is obviously better than none so I’d never discourage it …but I fear any improvement will be at a glacial pace.

Having met through a group of mutual friends, I’ve been ‘painted black’ behind my back to most, leaving only those knowing me best unaffected. I still love her, but the fact we’ve never ‘been as close’ leaves me wondering which direction the relationship’s headed… I need more than good intentions and healthy aspirations.

I’ve read, watched and learned all I can on BPD …and just don’t know if she has the strength or desire to take it on. And I can’t do it for her… I still love her, and am convinced she feels the same for me. It’s been suggested I attempt “radical acceptance” of the associated behavior, or, go ‘no contact’ and move on for good.

If accepting ‘radical behavior’ led to a more stable place, I’d continue it, because unbeknownst to me, that’s exactly what I’ve been accepting. My fear is that ‘acceptance’ leaves me with no boundaries and her free to fly off at will. And, I want what more resembles a real and healthy long-term relationship, the kind I witness among friends. I’m afraid that amid our friends we’ve become a joke…

What I find is after re-committing to her, my instinctive loyalty precludes finding anyone else … whereas her base behavior leaves her constantly searching; a fun and exciting mix for her - a dead end for me.

My advice to those with BPD? Determine who you can trust. From all I’ve read and learned from “nons” - you pick well. Most are dedicated beyond common sense to you, love you unconditionally, and are willing to escort you through Hell if necessary to emerge with the amazing person they’ve found at your core. Or, a family member that hasn’t used or deserted you… But find someone you can trust – then seek serious and lasting therapy, perhaps with them at your side.

I can imagine, and have actually felt the terror of doubting ones sanity. You are not alone in this hostile world. But if your life turns into a pattern of self-destructive and relationship ending tragedies, be it with family or loved ones, admit that to the person you trust, and find help. Unconditional love and care from family, friends or a lover can only go so far …our lives are also difficult. Help ‘us’ help you.

It’s late, but I obviously remain in turmoil over a woman I love …and continue to seek help so I may help her. You’re loved, that’s easy. But realize, true love’s deep - and those who love you are willing and capable of doing what it takes to keep that love alive, trust them – there’s likely no one better ~


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 Post subject: Re: Outside looking in
PostPosted: Sun Sep 22, 2013 7:36 pm 
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Hey J/A …where’s everybody at? Posting seems to be working so I’ll try to respond to your last post (again :smile ):

(you said) “It's essential that she learn to deal with stress instead of having someone else eliminate it. In the early stages, she will need extra support, and I won't lie -- until she realizes she has some problems to work through, and starts to get help, she will more than likely blame you for the relationships short comings.

Very true, as that’s now playing itself out. It feels good ‘being here’ as she also receives some professional support. Actually, as our relationship is apparently discussed, I find my mate paying closer attention to my perspective, instead of instantly categorizing it as simply ‘my view.’ It seems she’s actually working on some of what I’ve described and observed as problems between us …that’s so nice. And not being ‘blamed’ …bliss.

When I step out from that shadow and look at what is really going on, I'm able to discern where my faults lie and where his faults begin. It's tricky sometimes because I think I'm being rational but really I'm so colored in my perceptions.

Thank you so much for describing your thoughts and feelings, that’s why I came here, to learn. It must be so difficult to constantly doubt your instincts and perspectives. Feelings that come to you so naturally, though actually betray you. That’s why it seems so important to find someone you can trust. But if you can’t trust your judgment, crap. What I’ve found with my relationship is she’s learned she can trust me – that after given ample opportunity to move on, I haven’t, and neither has she. She knows I continue to love her and am still willing to support her. It has felt like a test… but if that’s what it takes for her to feel safe, so be it.

Outside, I wonder if showing her this forum is the right thing.

I doubt that …and if she ever stumbles onto it, and finds ‘our correspondence’ – yikes? But if (you do ;-) she does ‘find it,’ I’m pleased and proud she’s looking to learn. Ultimately, it would/ will be to both our benefits to understand BPD to its fullest. I actually find it amazing, like being on the cutting-edge of science. There’s so much yet to be discovered, as brain mapping alone continues to pinpoint reasons. The insight you’ve shared adds to human knowledge. But no, I won’t lead her here…

I wanted to fight for that happiness- that richness.

I hope it’s no longer such a battle. And again, your insight and candor is ..beautiful. And as mentioned, she’s sought help. She’s starting slow, so I’m not injecting anything ‘BPD related’ into our discussions, she seems so fragile. It appears so temping to fall back on lifelong traits of survival or avoidance. It also seems that having a ‘normal relationship,’ like we both witness among friends remains elusive. But, we’re there for each other, very much in love, and as personally (if not legally) committed as can be to each other. I find it beautiful – because amid the BPD, there’s a Being like no other, and when she tells me she’s mine …I’m hers.

--- old patterns which saved us from pain as children but do not serve us in adulthood.

I’m happy to see this post so well read – statements like that are likely beneficial to all. I’m responding as I read, and may have touched upon that, but thanks again for bringing it to my attention. I love when she thinks out loud – ‘just keep going’ is my only request. I’ve read and seen there’s an element of ‘shame’ in her feelings, that’s painful to witness but healthy to share. I welcome it, and would never use such insight against her, but some apparently have … if triggered by her often cutting remarks. I won’t do that, unless the irony’s so obvious it's good for an instant laugh, and appreciated by both.

While there are certain criteria which define our disorder; the criteria does NOT define who we are as people.

Well put. I’m not here to fight with a disorder or a person, I love that person and want to be a significant part of her life – period The ‘disorder’s’ what it is – something to recognize yet not get hung up on …as much as both of us would love to kick the sh*t out of it.. we simply need to be aware of it – and move ahead.

I love it here. It's my haven, and we all are supportive of each other.

I can see that… and both feel your pain and growth, impressive. You know… it would be very interesting to see how the general population would fair given …6 months of what you experience on a daily basis… Be proud of your strengths, those who truly love you see and value them, the rest may have no idea… Their loss.

Hey, I’ve got some questions too… if that’s ok? They stem from where we’re currently at. As mentioned, there’s been progress, but the problem I’m having is her reluctance to be with me around mutual friends. She recently ‘asked one thing I’d change about her’ if I could. Thinking fast, I said her impulsivity. I see it used against her, to coerce her by those she’d consider ‘friends,’ but in my eyes are more closely related to predators … which could really lead me on a tangent regarding how, with an inkling of BPD knowledge, some could very easily use and/ or hurt her simply by knowing which strings to pull… gurrrrr..

OK, back to my concern: I asked her what she’d ‘change’ about me? She said it wasn’t as much “about me,” but “how people viewed me.” Ouch? Actually, I feel viewed quite well by my friends …which more than anything confirms to me that she’s badmouthed me to our friends to justify her multiple ‘breakups’ with me… So, she’s (finally) determined I’m straight, honest and trustworthy … only to have to eat her words before we return to circulation as ‘a couple?’ Damn, thinking out loud like this, and ‘this’ being my most current concern as a couple …that makes me kinda upset.. She’s been great about having me over to her place, and coming up to visit me – but when it comes to going out amid mutual friends, that’s not happening. So how’s she going to change how ‘other’s think of me’..? gurrrr?

No, the challenges never seem to cease … and it’s a good thing I just busted out laughing. I’ve no problem facing our friends, never have, and have nothing to hide from …other than she’s likely told them all the stuff you’d share with a significant other to turn them on me. Ohhh Kayy.. this is beginning to bother me – but it’s where ‘we’re’ currently at – apparently re-introducing ourselves as a couple. How sweet ;)


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 Post subject: Re: Outside looking in
PostPosted: Tue Oct 01, 2013 8:13 am 
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Hi Outside!

Sorry I haven't been by lately, life has been very hectic but I remembered our conversation and thought I'd check in!

It's quite late here in Aus but I will send you a proper reply in the morning - just didn't want you to think it was futile posting ;)

Jess


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