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This might take a while to read....and it has to do with my teenage son.....my ex.....and my ex's new wife trying to alienate my son from me....and me wanting to just walk away.....but not wanting to make my son feel abandoned....although I feel he's clearly choosing to push me away.

I don't even know if this is a BPD thing or not. I do know that my T has told me that the stuff I'm dealing with now is linked to my previous behavior....it's like now I'm picking up the mess that I made (or at least helped to make) over the course of my son's life.

Here's the thing....he lived with me until last November. He was 14.5 when he moved out. At that time (just prior to leaving) he was still very affectionate and loving with me.....although he also was starting to assert himself more and we had a few conflicts last summer as he tried to tell me I couldn't tell him what to do....etc....
We had a good relationship, he confided in me and was generally very loving with me.....although I also had a hard time with him....he's extremly independent.......he was still respectful and kind and loving.

Immediately after he moved in with his dad that all changed. He didn't want to see me, he was distant when he did and basically our relationship was "on hold". After a couple of months he eased up a little....we're still distant....but he was able to hug me and say he loved me....etc.....

But since then his father has been fighting with me non-stop about anything he can come up with (and since I now have learned how to not "fight" back......he's frustrated). He has "lost" everything he's tried to take from me and I think the last thing he can go after is my son. In other words.....he can use his relationship with my son to "hurt" me......and at this point I think that is what he really wants. (He's a sick man.....I wrote about him previously).

I can handle it ok. I miss my son....but I also think that him breaking away from me is normal. I guess my concern is that I think he lives in an environment which is toxic against me (they talk about me and how horrible they think I am......I'm the villan in their lives and they are the victims.....I'm the "enemy" (so I understand from what my daughter reports).

To confuse the issue....my ex was trying to get my daughter to move in with him and that basically blew up in his face because he manipulated her into saying she wanted to move in with him....so he went to court to try to take custody from me....I fought back....I got a lawyer.....and he was losing so he got a lawyer.....he still lost....and then he also lost $.......so he's mad at my daughter....but instead blames me and accuses me of controllig my daughter (12).......but like the idiot that he is....he doesn't give her credit for being able to make her own decisions........and so she gets mad at him because he won't listen to her.....she gets frustrated with him.

So yadda yadda yadda....I could go on and on but I don't really want to bore you. I just want to know if anyone out there has any idea of how I should relate to my son now. This week he has made excuses for not seeing me and it sounds like he won't be visiting much in the future. I think he's being set up by his dad......because his dad expects me to get all upset and dramatic and lose my temper eventually....and then he wins. Instead, I'm practicing the 4 agreements and trying to focus on being lovingly detached. The catch 22 for me is how to continue to be loving without being demanding or hurt when my son refuses to see me. In a way I just want (emotionally) to completely withdraw from him and ignore him until he reaches out to me. However, I think that is a BPD reaction....and may hurt him. On the other hand....maybe it's not....and maybe that's what he needs me to do....I don't know!!!!

Secretly I'll tell you that a part of me is saying "yay"....I don't have to deal with my son as a teen. Then the other part of me says OMG I'm a bad, uncaring, unloving mom and how horrible it is that I enjoy time away from him. i feel guilty for that.

(((Skiotter)))

I'm so sorry that you are having to deal with all of this. I think you are doing a fantastic job with what your given, fwiw. Really, brava to you for handling your ex in a more productive way. I know that takes quite a bit of strength and I think you need to acknowledge and congratulate yourself on that!

I'm not a Mom.....so my view here may not help. But, it's worth a try.......

Teenagers are TOUGH. In more ways than one. You had a good relationship with your son for the first 14.5 years of his life-- no matter what his father is feeding him, that counts. Boys his age, especially independent ones, tend to pull away from both parents anyway-- especially their Mom's. I know his father's influence matters.....but is it possible he would be acting in a similar way towards you even without that influence? That maybe some of this is NOT about his dad and what he says about you? Are you taking this all a bit too personally (he is a teenager, after all, going through some rough stuff on his own)?

My best advice would be to continue being the best Mom you know how to be despite his reservations. You ARE stil his mother-- NOT his friend. It's okay for him to get upset with you and vice/versa. It's okay for you to make him do things (including hang out with you) even if he doesn't want to do them.....he may find he enjoys it more than he thought he would. Maybe not too, but still. I think healthy communication would be key here.

You are allowed to be demanding (somewhat)-- you are his Mother! You are also allowed to be hurt when he does something hurtful. You're human. I think the trick here is showing him stability, not moodiness. Be consistant. Explain your reactions. Talk to him-- he's gotta be 15 (or almost) by now. Remember he thinks he knows all there is to know at that age!

Please don't ignore or withdraw. That sounds to me like he's testing you-- "If I push her away, will she go?" or "Dad says Mom doesn't love me....how can I prove that to myself". Pass the test-- keep being the loving mother you have always been. I do think that ignoring him or pulling away would be a BPD reaction (although I'm sure normals have the urge to!). Don't give in. You are the parent, you have to be the strong one (as much as that sucks sometimes). He shouldn't-- yes, I said shouldn't-- have to reach out to you, you are the ADULT. Act like one and he will respect it even if he doesn't show it or like it. I don't mean that you can be overbearing.....it's that grey balance you are searching for with this. He does need space and time to be with friends....but he also needs his mother. I know you can find grey!


Girl.....ROFL. No one wants to deal with a teenager!

And no, you are NOT a bad, uncaring, unloving Mom. It's okay to need time away from him-- it doesn't mean you don't love him! Sheesh, you posting here about all of this, worrying so-- sounds to me like you love him and are a better Mom than you know/realize. Give yourself some credit!!

I pretty much agree with Harmonium.

I don't know if you can *make* him spend time with him if he's refusing, but I would continue to offer to be available to him, especially on terms that might appeal to a teenage boy -- all the teenaged boys in my family have been all about FOOD, so invitations out to eat his favorite food might work, or a shopping trip to the mall, or a movie, or whatever. Something simple and non-threatening. I wouldn't try to have a conversational agenda, but I'd ask him generally about what's going on in his world. If he doesn't want to talk about it, then I'd let it go and just stick to general topics like music or sports or anything else that he might be interested in. I think you should avoid as much as possible any discussion of your problems with his father, unless it's to say very clearly that those issues are *your* stuff and not his, and that you will do everything you can to keep him from feeling like he's caught in the middle of your disputes with your ex. The main thing is that he knows that you love him, no matter whether you see him a lot these days, and you will always be there for him if he needs you. The more you can be calm, consistent, loving, and available (without strings attached), the more likely it will be that he will one day restore a close relationship with you. That might not happen anytime soon, but the more he sees you as challenging his choices and decisions, including his relationship with his father, the less likely it will occur at all. Your ex might continue to try to poison his mind, and there isn't much you can do about that, but if you don't get sucked into his game it will be better for you. If your son sees a "you" that is consistently NOT like the witch his father says you are, he might eventually come to trust you more and his dad less.

I have two kids who are now in their 20s, and fortunately they were old enough when I got divorced that there were no custody issues. They are close to both me and their dad, and I try very hard not to dump my frustration with my ex on them -- it shouldn't be their problem. I'm sorry you're having to go through all this. Since I didn't really have to deal with what you are, I don't know if what I said is a good plan or not, but it's the way I would approach your situation if I did have to face it.

Sari and Harmonium,

Thank you very much for your replies. It really does help a lot. It gives a third person perspective that is not available now in my life.....so (thank you!!)

I called him today and left a message telling him that I love him and I want to see him on Monday.....whenever he's available. Hopefully he'll come...but if not at least he knows I am thinking of him, etc.....

H: what you said made me remember that i really don't want my child to have to go through what I have in life...so I have to remember each and every day to put his needs first.....not his wants...but his needs.

Sari: It is nice to have another parental opinion....I know you know how hard it is.....and yet you hold me to a high standard of behavior that I respect and want for myself.

This is really hard for me because so often I feel guilty for the "s#@!" I put this child through when he was very young. I struggle with feeling worthy of being his mother. I also fear that I failed a test he gave me last November when he told me he wanted to move out. I felt rejected and hurt and a little relieved so I impulsively let him go that very weekend. Everyone around me has told me that was a mistake.........now I just don't know for sure.

It is so hard to deal with this Bpd when it comes to my kids. The connection is so deep and intimate....it is hard for me. He's a really really smart boy....and fools most people because he talks like he's much older than he is.....people think he's very mature.....but he's not. He's really very much a 14 year old...almost 15......but he has worldly interests and retains facts like you wouldn't believe. he has learned to see himself as the expert in most everything......and everyone else is a fool. I feel like that is a danger only because as a result he feels he can control everything around him.....and I firmly believe that children (yeah he's a teen but he's still a kid) need to feel that someone else is still in control so that they feel secure. Even as teens.

With other people he can fool them, trick them.....pull the wool over their eyes....but to me it's all a farce and i see it hurting him because he gets a false sense of authority ......my fear is that he has hidden low self esteem and that when he gets to college he'll just fall under with the competition and pressure. He's never been challenged in school much and now that it's getting tougher....he's in accelerated classes.....he's not rising to the challenge....I think that is a self defensive behavior that is a result of his false sense of superiority....

ahhhh....maybe I'm just thinking too much.

anyway...thank you both for responding. I need help with this.......

What good would come from knowing for sure? Can you change any of it now? I don't think focusing/worrying over the past is productive for you-- I think it leads to you feeling 'less than' when in fact, currently, you are certainly not. It sounds to me like you are a very good parent now no matter what has happened back then. It's the now that counts!


I can really identify with your son. I did the same sort of things at his age. But.....my parent (Dad) didn't know how to help me through it. I moved out on my own at barely 16.
It's a good thing that you see through his bravado, that you can see how it hurts him. Use that to your advantage as a parent and help him through. I suspect you are correct thinking a lot of it stems from a hidden low self-esteem (mine did, I could 'fake' it well like him though). Give him safe harbor where that bravado is not necessary. Find a way to let him know (gently) that you see the real him. He will appreciate it, even if he doesn't show that at the time. Teach him some of the ways you know to build his own self-esteem. Wow, if my Dad had known how to help me with mine.....well, I just think it's really important. But....he is still a separate person; you can't do any of this for him. You can just guide!

I think you are doing much better with all of this than you realize. Good parents, in my mind, do over-think some things......I think it shows just how much you do care and want to be the best mother you can. Just remember that perfection is unattainable. You can just do your best for any given situation or time-- THAT you ARE doing. Give yourself credit!!