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 Post subject: I guess I am impossible to deal with
PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2008 9:23 am 
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So, first my nutritionist and now my therapist doesn't want to work with me anymore. I told him (my T) that I want to take a break from therapy for a while because I seem to be wasting time and energy and getting nowhere and he agreed that it makes sense for me to stop therapy but when I said I would call him when I was ready to really commit to therapy, he said I "might want to find someone whom you really respect and start with that person." OUCH. I know that I had a hard time really committing to therapy but geez am I really that impossible? I feel hopeless :( I want to go eat a whole bunch of cookies.

Yesterday I read some of the links on the homepage for this website. I read the stuff on starting your recovery and the poem about the two paths and the cliff and I know that what I really need to do is TAKE THE PLUNGE but I have been SO resistant. I need to find inspiration to stop resisting change and dive into recovery. Or else, I fear more of my relationships will end as the one with my nutritionist and therapist did :(


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2008 12:39 pm 
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Were you able to discuss your T's reaction some more? Why did he bring "respect" into it? Have you talked about that before or is there truth to that?

I think it all just takes time. I often though too I could dive into therapy and see myself as this "recovering" working hard person, but I am not sure it is that easy. It seems that changing one problem at a time is more realistic, though I find that even difficult.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2008 1:50 pm 
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Hey C2L -
My T and I discussed my acting out, lack of commitment to therapy, etc. at our last meeting. He asked me about other people in my life - do I respect my mother? how about my father? And I asked him where he was going with that - if he thought I don't respect him - and he confirmed that he got that impression from me. I don't know if it is a lack of respect for him so much as my not committing to making changes and doing the work in therapy. I do have some "negative" feelings toward him but I never actually brought them up: (1) it bothers me a little that he is "just" a social worker, not a psychologist or psychiatrist; (2) I don't think he is a very good therapist (not that that is true - mostly I was not a good patient but I wanted things to go better than they did). I guess my reason for posting this whole thread was to figure out where to go from here. Do I just abandon the idea of "recovery from BPD" and go on living my life? Do I look for another therapist and try to do therapy the right way this time? Do I try doing some "recovery" work on my own, without therapy?
Thanks for writing...


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2008 1:56 pm 
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A wise friend of mine at another community gave another one of my friends some wonderful advice / words of wisdom. Feel free to substitute out things that don't apply (drugs, eating, etc.) for things that do apply (whatever they may be.)

strangerr wrote:
You are at the point where you can no longer imagine life without drugs, disordered eating, and other insane behavior. You don't like some of the results of these behaviors, but this life feels normal to you and living any other way scares the shit out of you.

If you are *lucky*, you will get to a point where you will no longer be able to imagine life *with* these things, either. You will feel trapped and you will want to die. I hope you get to that point, and I hope you remember this when you get there: THERE IS A WAY OUT, and it's not dying.

If you're not so lucky, you might very well continue going on living the way that you're living now for many years. That happens to a lot of people, probably the majority of people like us.

I didn't get the impression you're suicidal. That wasn't the point I was after.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2008 2:07 pm 
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Thank you Ash. No, not suicidal - just feeling hopeless. Disappointed that two "mental health professionals" got too frustrated to work with me. But what you just posted is exactly what I need - I need to get sick of "screwing around" and get serious about being healthy. All of that applies to me. I know what my problem is - I need to come to that "OK, that's it, I've had enough" point where I am sick of the acting out, etc. and throw myself into recovery. I just want to get to that point sooner! I did it once before in a big way. I got sick of being overweight and unhealthy and I joined Weight Watchers and lost 89 lbs. I put 110% into it. But why can't I find that same energy to recover from BPD? Is the "illness" more ingrained in me? Is it really just too scary for me to give up my old ways?


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2008 2:36 pm 
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The thought running through my mind...
We usually get out what we put in.

When you were working with these two, were you taking them seriously? Were you listening and following directions? Were you doing your homework? You say you weren't committed to your recovery...
So how much effort were you putting IN?

Stay with me here...I don't think YOU are impossible at all.
But it sounds as if your BEHAVIOR was headed that way.

If I am not doing my part of the work, I will not get the full benefit of therapy. As much as my T cares about me and wants to help me learn, he CANNOT and WILL NOT do my work for me. Why should he waste his time if I'm not willing?
(My T and I have had that discussion more than once when I've start slacking. I'm wasting my time and money, and taking up office time he could use to somebody who actually WANTS to do what it takes.)

There is a good side to this. Since the problem seems to be your behavior, your willingness to work - those things can be changed!
YOU aren't impossible at all.
Just uncommitted...
not the same thing at all!

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2008 3:38 pm 
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You're right, Minx. But why am I not willing or motivated? What did you do when your T told you to cut the crap and start actually doing the work? How did you start? And WHY?


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2008 4:11 pm 
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Why? I can't tell you why, because everybody's why is personal.

I just don't want to be messed up anymore. I finally got to the point where it just hurt to much to NOT do anything. That point where I'm less afraid of the Great Recovery Unknown than I am my ordinary sucky life. That moment where DOING something feels better than NOT.

It takes a LOT of conscious effort for me some days. I don't know about you, but I coast in autopilot pretty often. It takes effort for me to remember to take care of my responsibilities because I shrugged that stuff off for so long. A friend told me that the way I used to live was (in this order)
    what I want to do
    what I ought to do
    what I need to do
My life actually runs a lot smoother if I can prioritize things this way
    what I need to do
    what I ought to do
    THEN what I want to do

That doesn't sound like a lot of fun, but it really works out better. When I get to doing the things I want to do, I've gotten the other stuff out of the way and I don't have anything hanging over my head.

Why don't you want to do this work? I don't know. I really don't. I know SOME of why I fight it.
"It's no fun!"
"I'm going to be bored"
"I don't want to"
"I'm scared"
"I can't"
hold up...When I say "I can't" I'm making excuses to myself. Usually, CAN'T means WON'T or DON'T WANNA. Think about that...

We could look for years to find out why you don't want to commit to therapy...But I think you'd find that "why" a lot faster if you DID decide to go all the way. I can put off a lot of growth by "trying to figure it out". Figuring CAN be good, but not if it keeps me from moving forward.

Even without a nutritionist and a therapist, I bet you know some things you could be doing (or avoiding) to take better care of yourself. Why don't you write some of those things out and choose one or two to work on by yourself (with us)?

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 Post subject: Impossible to deal with?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2008 5:13 pm 
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It does not sound to be as if your therapist said or even implied that you were too difficult to deal with.

You said that you wanted to take a break from therapy and he merely acknowledged that therapy was difficult for you and you found it difficult to commit and do the work of therapy.

It makes sense to me that you should find someone that you clearly respect so to close off the possibility of you not doing the work because you think "he is ONLY a social worker" or "he is not that good a therapist".

Given how difficult it is for you to become "willing" you certainly do not need to have questions about the qualifications of your therapist as an "easy out"

It sounds like he mirrored what you were saying/feeling and it is fine to just end the relationship and move on.

It is probably not positive for you to label yourself as impossible!

RRR


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2008 11:45 am 
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I almost started a new thread in Undo the Twist but this statement fits here as well:

"I feel that I SHOULD be working on recovery" (twisted thinking) and that is why I went to therapy. But deep down I never really WANTED to give up my old ways. I am still kind of stuck in that place where, as my T used to say, I "get gratification from my symptoms." How can I untwist that "should" statement and motivate myself in a positive way? Somewhere deep down a part of me WANTS to work on recovery but that part needs help breaking through...


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2008 12:18 pm 
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One idea on untwisting, from the Ten Ways to Untwist Your Thinking
Quote:
8. The Semantic Method: Simply substitute language that is less colorful and emotionally loaded. This method is helpful for 'should statements.' Instead of telling yourself, "I shouldn't have made that mistake," you can say, "It would be better if I hadn't made that mistake."

Perhaps something like, "It would be helpful to me to work on recovery because..." and then add a reason.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2008 12:36 pm 
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here, our therapists must have a masters degree to counsel. that is about 6 years of school or more. psychologists have a phd, and psychiatrists are MDs with a speciality in mental health. altho most pdrs i have met dont know their head from their ass.

have you considered what goes into being able to counsel legally? a TON. ongoing classes also to keep up their license.

maybe this will help you see the Ts in a diff light?

""""I don't know if it is a lack of respect for him so much as my not committing to making changes and doing the work in therapy. I do have some "negative" feelings toward him but I never actually brought them up: (1) it bothers me a little that he is "just" a social worker, not a psychologist or psychiatrist; (2) I don't think he is a very good therapist (not that that is true - mostly I was not a good patient but I wanted things to go better than they did).""" you also to realize we get out of counseling what we put into it. of course there are many really bad ones out there, and one must choose and make sure we "connect" with a T. so maybe this one wasnt the right fit. personalities come into play with counseling. my Ts partner is a really nice, nice lady but i dont do well at all in a session with her. she drives me nuts, actually.

so its kinda 6 of one, half dozen of the other. takes two for it to work.

i do relate to your hesitation on recovery. its very scary.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2008 12:59 pm 
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I just had foot surgery. I had a bunion and a hammertoe that needed to be fixed. The only reason I got them fixed is because they started to hurt. Otherwise I wouldn't have had the surgery.

When your behavior hurts you so bad and you can't take it anymore, that's when you'll know you're ready to work on yourself. When your behaviors cause you more damage than good. You'll get it fixed when it hurts too much.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2008 2:22 pm 
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Well put, BG. I just wish it hurt me as much as it is hurting the others around me :(


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2008 2:48 pm 
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NotaMonster,

You're reluctant to make the changes. Your therapist has said that you get "gratification from your symptoms." Are these two things related? You might try asking yourself several questions:

1. What are my symptoms and ingrained ways of behaving?

2. What gratification do I get from sticking with them and not changing?

3. Now list the Pros & Cons of changing. Then list the Pros & Cons of staying the same way you are now.

4. Look at your lists. Ask, Which path would benefit me more: staying the way I am or changing?

5. If the answer is "Changing," make a commitment toward change.

6. If you still feel resistant, why? Are there other things holding you back?


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