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My T told me yesterday that I have some aspects of Schizotypal Personality Disorder. He went down the list of symptons - I don't have them all but I have some of them. He said he and my pdoc both believe I have these tendencies. I am right now absorbing this. He said I have paranoid ideation. I guess I know I tend to get paranoid, but I didn't know there was a specific disorder about it. He said I also display inappropriate affect - like if you ask me how I am I'll say "fine" but my body and facial features shows I am not fine. I have some of the other symptoms too.

This is all new to me. I wonder if anyone else here has this diagnosis or these traits. Can you do anything about it? It seems so weird to me. Like what else are they going to tell me is wrong about me? And when he told me, I started to almost have a dissociative attack. It didn't seem real to me. I didn't tell him that - it sort of came and went.

I'm trying to work on the depression right now. That's what I've been focusing on. Now I have to absorb this stuff too. Any thoughts?

Hi BG! I wouldn't worry about these "diagnoses." Paranoia and schizophrenia are simply aspects of BPD - they are just characteristics that people with BPD often demonstrate. Personally, I have found that when I focus on the "diagnoses" of BPD, eating disorder, problem drinker, etc. - it tends to "trigger me" and I get anxiety attacks, and start acting out. It is better to just focus on how to improve your life overall. In other words, you suffer from depression, which is part of your BPD. But instead of focusing on "well, I am a borderline and that is why I am depressed" try focusing on ways to improve your life and manage the depression. One thing at a time, OK? Right now I am focusing on eating properly and drinking less. By getting those two things under control, I am also working on my BPD without actually thinking of it as "working on my BPD." Get it?

-NAM

I do.

When I took the PDQ4, I scored almost evenly (very high) in BPD and StPD. The BPD causes me far more problems, so we focus primarily on that, but I definitely have strong Schizotypal traits, if not the full-blown PD.

What can you do about it? The same thing you're already doing - keep working toward recovery. The same sort of self observation and awareness that helps with BPD can help with an awful lot of unhealthy traits. If you have symptoms that are really getting in your way, you can talk to your T and pdoc about ways to treat them. But beyond that, the mindfulness, the personal responsibility and the learning that you have been doing still apply. They are still (IMHO) the most effective tools you have.

All these diagnoses are merely clusters of symptoms and traits. Nothing is absolute, and nothing is forever. I have become familiar with my clusters so that I can keep an eye on traits that cause me trouble. If I'm paranoid, then it helps me to recognize that and take it into account when I start feeling that way. If I prefer my "own little world" and start spending too much time there, I can learn to recognize that and change the behavior.

I take anti-depressants and a mood stabilizer/anti-psychotic. It's very convenient that I can call it a mood stabilizer, but I began taking it for my mini-psychotic symptoms. Paranoia, jealousy, etc. The medication is an important component of keeping my mind focused. The rest of the work is the same psychological stuff I've been doing.

What we have doesn't matter as much as what we choose to do about it. I like having a diagnosis because it gives me a starting point. Beyond that? My treatment is more important than we think I might have.

Thank you Minx! What you said really meant a lot to me. I have been dealing with depression and anxiety for as long as I can remember. I'm used to it. But paranoia and jealousy and suspicion - those are new to me. I mean, I must have had them all along, but no one ever pointed it out to me.

I take anti-psychotics too. I guess I never really understood why I take them. And I was thinking about this today. I guess if I'm behaving paranoid, I don't realize I am acting that way. To me, what I'm thinking is "normal." I have to learn how to tell if I am indeed acting that way. But also, when I do feel paranoid, to me, I have good reason to. And now I see that I don't. So it's all mixed up. It's almost like I don't have good judgment about myself. I don't know how to trust myself.

I've been reading the stuff you've been posting these past few days Minx. You sound so clear-headed and smart and on-the-ball. Everything you say makes perfect sense. It's hard to think of you as having those StPD behaviors. Whereas I, often, am off-the-fucking-wall. How do I know what I say and think makes sense, or if it's from some wacko PD that I have? How can I differentiate? Now that I think about it, even my H sees it. I didn't tell him what my T told me yesterday, but looking back at what my H has said to me in the past, he knows it. He sees it. Yet to me, the way I think is so "right." Oh gosh.......

I'm glad he gave me the diagnosis, but it's scary. I know now I have a basis from which to work, but as I said, I don't know if I can trust myself anymore. I will keep working and talking to my T, etc. etc.

And welcome to the true challenge of the Personality Disorder!
That's why PD's (BPD, NPD, StPD, etc.) can be SO hard to treat. We grew up learning that these thought and behavior patterns ARE normal for our abnormal circumstances. And so, internally, it all adds up - until we use those patterns out in the "real, normal" world. Then we get all that conflict and confusion because everything we were taught doesn't work like it's "supposed to"!

It can take a long time for people who suffer from PDs to even realize that they might have a problem, because it all still adds up inside. SO the problem must be "out there", right? We're the lucky ones...as difficult as recovery can be and as much crap as we have to sort through, at least we have become aware that there's something we can DO about it.

I work on "reality checks" and "humility points". Remember when you were having trouble with the student in your group? I started breaking it down into statistics - if everything divided equally, how many minutes of the hour could she really be spending on you? That's one of my checks. If I start feeling that sort of paranoia, I do go for the numbers. My perceptions may be whacked, but my math is usually pretty good...And when I look at it from that perspective, I'm just not all that important (which in the case of paranoia can be a GOOD thing!).

I need to get out of the office here, but I'll try to get online tonight and get back to this with you. If not tonight, there's always lunchtime tomorrow!

Thanks Minx. My T brought up the student, but I can't go there right now. Okay, okay - I don't want to. I still think the way I thought was just "how I was feeling." I don't want anybody to take that away from me.

But that aside, so I have to learn how to have reality checks. Whew. Is my T a good reality check? Does he have an "agenda"? Do I put all my trust in him? Who else do I ask? How do I even know if I AM acting paranoid? Is it when I spend too much time obsessing about something?

This is more complicated than just dealing with depression. This is a whole new way of thinking. I'm still working on the other post regarding validation. Now I have to work on this too. I'm going to stay home tomorrow and ponder all of this. Thank G-d I'm in a good mood and not depressed, otherwise I could never wrap my head around this.

Thanks for working with me Minx. It really helps. I should be here all day tomorrow.

Hi BG:

Your T indicated that he and your Pdoc believe you have ASPECTS of the disorder; I think that's what I read.

So, they are NOT saying that you have the full-on dx, is that correct?

You have shared here on the board so I bring it up in an effort to try to help put a different perspective on this, that you tend to believe that you have things when people suggest it to you and sort of embrace or own it (my wording) as if the whole enchillada was applicable to you, when really, in this instance, it is being suggested to you that you may have some [just SOME] aspects or traits of a particular dx. NOT THE WHOLE THING, right?

Given the above, do you think you might be taking on more than was really meant?

I'd be blown away if a T suggested that I had aspects of some new label, too; I'm not at all saying it's not distressing or trying to invalidate your feelings on that, believe me.

But I am trying to urge you to hear and take in what your T actually said it AND in the context (about the student) in which it came up.

Frankly, I wouldn't have liked the student taking notes business either, so I think, as to that one thing anyway, opinions can vary, AND T's/Pdocs aren't always correct, but let's say they are. Your T only said 'aspects' to you.

I think Minx would agree with what I'm emphasizing to you here, bc this certainly is not about the dx itself. It's about looking again at what was actually said, evaluating that, and being extra careful (just my suggestion based upon what you've been open enough in the past to share as being a tendency you might struggle with) to NOTt take on and set about to 'owning' more than that.

Sending you positive energy ...

Warmest regards,

Candle

And this whole new way of thinking may just help ease that depression by bringing you power over some of your less healthy thought patterns.

Recovery is recovery. Most of it is the same type of skills - emotional self-regulation, impulse control, respond vs. react. Self-examination, personal responsibility, self-control and self-esteem. Those lessons do not change - no matter WHAT the diagnoses.

The same holds true with the idea that feelings are not facts.
Nobody wants to take your thoughts or feelings away. Not here, not in your T's office, not at home. You are free to feel whatever you do. Part of the recovery process involves learning to observe, evaluate and moderate our feelings. I can, do and will feel whatever I feel - but sometimes those feelings are out of proportion to the situation. Sometimes those feelings come from my skewed perception. Sometimes those feelings come from bad information. When my feelings take me out of balance, then I need to take a look at what's going on inside my head.

And that's how I get a clue that my thinking/feeling is off kilter. Am I really upset? Am I obsessing? Does this make sense? Are these persistent, unpleasant thoughts? The more intense my reaction is, the more likely I'm reacting from that unbalanced state of mind. That's a tip for me to do a reality check or two. I don't see it as being about whether I'm being right or wrong. It's about whether my response feels balanced. If not, it can help me to run it by someone to see how it sounds. heck - sometimes I can tell I'm getting "out there" just by listening to myself as I talk with someone else. have you ever said (or felt) "I know this might sound crazy..."? that can be a clue.

Who can you trust? I'm not sure what you mean. A reality check doesn't have to any kind of huge special deal. It might be sometimes, but not always. Who would you normally talk to about making decisions? Friends, husband, the group, this board, your T, your religious leader, neighbors. It all depends on what's going on at that point and how well you are (or are not) feeling. But remember - just because someone may think you're overreacting - that's not FOR SURE, and you don't need to second guess yourself all the time. The observations of other people in your life are data. When their data conflicts with yours, it's just a sign to pay closer attention.

It's just a few more symptoms, and you manage them pretty much the same way you are learning to manage everything else. You've been making some pretty good progress so far, and I believe that you'll continue!

Honestly, I don't remember for sure if my T said I have "traits" or if I actually have the diagnosis. If I'm remembering correctly, he said I have the diagnosis but don't have all the traits, just as with BPD - I have the diagnosis but not all the traits. I'll have to ask him when I see him on Tuesday. While he was talking to me, I was zoning out a bit. I think I was getting overwhelmed. That's why I don't remember exactly.

Minx, that is something I need to absorb - that feelings are not facts. I tend to believe what I FEEL is what is real. That doesn't make it so. I do understand what you say about when feelings are out of proportion to the situation. I think that happens to me a lot. So I have to sit down and evaluate what is really going on.

Right now I'm in a good mood. I'm not depressed. My head is not FUZZY! When my head gets fuzzy, that's when I run into trouble. I can't think straight. It's like there's this netting over my brain. And when I run into an issue, I want so much to believe that what I'm feeling is RIGHT. Well, it shouldn't matter if I'm right or not. What matters is how I react and how I behave. I can't have everything all tied up neatly in a pretty little bow. As they say in some commercial, life is messy.

I would like to think that at some level I can trust myself and my perceptions. Right now, I don't know if I can. Besides all of these tendencies and diagnoses, I have OCD tendencies (not the actual disorder) and that doesn't help either. I see things a certain way, I want things a certain way, I expect things to be done in a certain way. It's all tied together. It's like in order to get better I have to break out of the box. Sometimes I step outside of the box, but usually I'm inside of it most of the time. More work to do.

I'm starting to zone out here. I will come back to this. I need to talk to my T about this next week. Thanks guys!!!! :think